StartupNorth: Is Dragon’s Den bad for innovation?
Omar Ismail
· 2 years ago
This post is kind of silly. You're not really lamenting the existence of Dragon's Den, but rather lamenting the NON-existence of some other show celebrating Canada's innovators.
I don't think any half-smart entrepreneur is going to be getting their VC lessons from Dragon's Den, there are far better resources than that including this blog right here and things like Sean Wise's blog/book (the book is actually really good).
You're also discounting the learning that comes from watching other people present. If you're paying attention you can learn a lot about how to properly present yourself, what things you should say and shouldn't say, etc. It's actually quite valuable in that regard.
I think you're also not recognizing that a lot of ideas that come across investor's desks are pretty horrible. Talk to any VC and they'll tell you the same thing. 90% of the stuff they hear about is crap. Just like in DD.
However, giving them the CHANCE to show their stuff and ask for money is far better than locking the door, because it's foolish to make judgments too early and potentially miss a great new thing. This kind of ultra-conservative thinking is precisely what is holding Canada back! The US is the source for both the most innovative, and stupidest ideas because they embrace them all.
David Crow
· 2 years ago
Omar,
You are missing the point!
90% of the pitches are bound to be non-fundable. The problem is that most of those pitches never see the light of day. Instead we're putting "entrepreneurs" on air because they make good television. This is not about educating potential Canadian entrepreneurs. It's about pure entertainment. Just like watching William Hung isn't about how to become a best selling popstar.
Watching other people pitch is important. There are lots of examples of great product and venture pitches. These aren't happening on the Dragon's Den. These aren't venture pitches. These aren't product pitches. To see better examples, check out Guy Kawasaki's How to Be a Demo God - http://blog.guykawasaki.com/2006/01/how_to_be_a... or watch the pitches at Demo - http://www.demo.com/
Don't be fooled into believing that a Canadian copy of a British television show demonstrates relevance or talent of the people they put on. Shows like Venture - http://www.cbc.ca/venture/ that show the challenges of running, growing and operating a business are much better and much more relevant to entrepreneurs.
We should look for content that inspires, as well as entertains.
Jonas Brandon
· 2 years ago
Speaking of Dragon's Den... Turn on CBC at 8pm tonight (Wednesday) to catch a rerun of our very own... JobLoft!
Omar Ismail
· 2 years ago
I agree with everything you're saying about a venue for showing inspiring stories. I was actually going to point to the Venture program myself to counter your post.
I guess I didn't really make my point too clear then. I see DD as a way for a certain group of people to tell there stories. The fact of the matter is that there really are Canadians doing some pretty crazy things, and pouring the heart, soul, blood, sweat, tears, marriages, friends, and lives into.
I'm interested in hearing their motivations and why they're taking such a crazy path, and DD is a very efficient mechanism for doing so. The whole investment side isn't a big part of the show to me at all. It's only when there is a decently good idea like the animated billboard, soap dispenser and JobLoft that the investment part gets interesting. And I guess that's why the show works well. It works for the really bad stuff, and the really good stuff.
Kind of going into a different direction now, but DD IS a hit show. So I think it would be useful to see if there is some way for "real" entrepreneurs to benefit from it. It's almost like a self-fulfilling prophecy, the more good companies that present, the higher the prestige of the show, and the more good companies that will want to present. Is there someway to make the show more attractive for good companies?
Suzie Dingwall Williams
· 2 years ago
Let me start by saying that I am actually afraid of David Crow. He seems to have set up most of the new Toronto entrepreneur infrastructure, which I refer to in short hand as "DavidCamp". Plus, he wears the fancy-scary small-rimmed glasses, which tell you he probably uses words like "eponymous" in casual conversation.
I appreciate David's call to action, I really do. But I think we should move the dialogue away from Dragon's Den. It's got nothing to do with vc-fundable businesses, as David points out. But then again, it's not intended to. It's an aspirational show about giving folks with modest ideas cash to build modest businesses (and by modest, I mean businesses that may grow to only a few $100ks in revenue or to $30M in revenue. Great returns for angels like the Den, but bad returns for a vc). That's it.
They aren't sucking away resources that would otherwise help us build and sustain the hi-tech startups in town. The technology investors on the panel are still making angel technology investments. Is tv the right way to bolster the community and raise our profile anyhow?
All Comments
I don't think any half-smart entrepreneur is going to be getting their VC lessons from Dragon's Den, there are far better resources than that including this blog right here and things like Sean Wise's blog/book (the book is actually really good).
You're also discounting the learning that comes from watching other people present. If you're paying attention you can learn a lot about how to properly present yourself, what things you should say and shouldn't say, etc. It's actually quite valuable in that regard.
I think you're also not recognizing that a lot of ideas that come across investor's desks are pretty horrible. Talk to any VC and they'll tell you the same thing. 90% of the stuff they hear about is crap. Just like in DD.
However, giving them the CHANCE to show their stuff and ask for money is far better than locking the door, because it's foolish to make judgments too early and potentially miss a great new thing. This kind of ultra-conservative thinking is precisely what is holding Canada back! The US is the source for both the most innovative, and stupidest ideas because they embrace them all.
You are missing the point!
90% of the pitches are bound to be non-fundable. The problem is that most of those pitches never see the light of day. Instead we're putting "entrepreneurs" on air because they make good television. This is not about educating potential Canadian entrepreneurs. It's about pure entertainment. Just like watching William Hung isn't about how to become a best selling popstar.
Watching other people pitch is important. There are lots of examples of great product and venture pitches. These aren't happening on the Dragon's Den. These aren't venture pitches. These aren't product pitches. To see better examples, check out Guy Kawasaki's How to Be a Demo God - http://blog.guykawasaki.com/2006/01/how_to_be_a... or watch the pitches at Demo - http://www.demo.com/
Don't be fooled into believing that a Canadian copy of a British television show demonstrates relevance or talent of the people they put on. Shows like Venture - http://www.cbc.ca/venture/ that show the challenges of running, growing and operating a business are much better and much more relevant to entrepreneurs.
We should look for content that inspires, as well as entertains.
I guess I didn't really make my point too clear then. I see DD as a way for a certain group of people to tell there stories. The fact of the matter is that there really are Canadians doing some pretty crazy things, and pouring the heart, soul, blood, sweat, tears, marriages, friends, and lives into.
I'm interested in hearing their motivations and why they're taking such a crazy path, and DD is a very efficient mechanism for doing so. The whole investment side isn't a big part of the show to me at all. It's only when there is a decently good idea like the animated billboard, soap dispenser and JobLoft that the investment part gets interesting. And I guess that's why the show works well. It works for the really bad stuff, and the really good stuff.
Kind of going into a different direction now, but DD IS a hit show. So I think it would be useful to see if there is some way for "real" entrepreneurs to benefit from it. It's almost like a self-fulfilling prophecy, the more good companies that present, the higher the prestige of the show, and the more good companies that will want to present. Is there someway to make the show more attractive for good companies?
I appreciate David's call to action, I really do. But I think we should move the dialogue away from Dragon's Den. It's got nothing to do with vc-fundable businesses, as David points out. But then again, it's not intended to. It's an aspirational show about giving folks with modest ideas cash to build modest businesses (and by modest, I mean businesses that may grow to only a few $100ks in revenue or to $30M in revenue. Great returns for angels like the Den, but bad returns for a vc). That's it.
They aren't sucking away resources that would otherwise help us build and sustain the hi-tech startups in town. The technology investors on the panel are still making angel technology investments. Is tv the right way to bolster the community and raise our profile anyhow?